What do I need? Opinions please

[papakeith]

You know you all have them Give them to me.

I'm almost to the point where I will be drilling holes and an setting my first rivets on the wing ribs. I will be riveting stiffener angles to the nose ribs to start. I'm planning on squeezing the first coulple hundred/thousand rivets. No need for a gun and bucking bar just yet. My real dilemna is hand squeezing vs. pneumatic.

I've listened to CJ, and he has me thinking seriously about getting a pneumatic squeezer and just bypassing the hand squeezer altogether. The difference in initial investment doesn't really seem all that great.

What plusses and minuses do you all see with either method?

Beyond the actual squeezer, what am I going to need as far as other riveting support tools?

Thanks,

[Womack2005]

Since I got my pneumatic squeezer I haven't touched my manual squeezer once. The only thing is that I only have one yoke for it. I would recomend getting different yokes (no hole, longeron, etc..). I am going to be loking for yokes at OshVegas next week.

I am a big fan of the adjustable set also. Big time saver for me.

Did you already finish the tail kit...?

[bmurrish]

Will, He's building a Bearhawk and sharing his experience with us. Check out his website. Pretty cool looking bird.

[papakeith]

Kit? wazzat?


Will, I'm a tag along on this RV site. By the time I decided that the RV line and I weren't a good fit I had already become accustomed to this group. Besides, the wings of my Bearhawk are cobbled together in a very similar fashion to the RVs; aluminum construction, aluminun skinned, flush riveted.

Thanks for the thoughts on the squeezer. I've a feeling I'm gonna end up with one.

[Womack2005]

Very cool aircraft the Bearhawk. I look forward to following your progress

Bottom line - you can't go wrong with the pneumatic squeez

[cjensen]

Easy PK!! Pneumatic RULZ!!! I've found very little use for my hand squeezer since I bought the pneu halfway through the empennage. I haven't had a use for the no hole yoke yet, so I haven't purchased one yet (maybe at OSH next week...if Will doesn't beat me to the the deal!). I do have the longeron yoke that IS worth purchasing along with the standard 3" C-yoke.

The hand squeeza is nice to have, and if you get one, I would recommend a cheapy on ebay. I did that, and ended up just using it for dimpling and non structural rivets (it's not quite perfectly straight...)

[JohnR]

Get the pneumatic one, you won't regret it. When your done sell it to another builder or put it on Ebay. Win, win situation.

I have a 3 inch, logeron, and 4 inch no hole yolk and use them all. I especially like the 4 inch no hole.

[aparchment]

Pneumatic and don't look back PK!

Talk to Fred at Clear Air Tools. A stand up guy and he really knows his tools. I bought mine from him and I look forward to finishing my 7 with and and then using it for a 10!

Antony

[prestwich]

I got my pneumatic from Clear Air, too. I bought about $1400 worth of stuff from Fred, including a re-man CP214 squeezer with about six different yokes. That whole set cost about the same as a new squeezer alone. Fred's a great guy on the phone, but useless to try to email. I think I've sent him about six emails to which I never got a peep of a response, but if I call him he knows what I'm talking about. It's a little weird.

I never used a hand squeezer beyond about two practice rivets in another builder's shop before I started the RV. I'd read a bunch of debate here and elsewhere about hand vs. pneumatic, and I know that opinions vary. For me, one rivet squeezed with the pneu was all I needed to buy one. A manly man like PK could probably squeeze 'em with his thumb and forefinger, but I don't want to work that hard.

[LooseNut]

Ok, I'm going to disagree.

You don't need the pneumatic squeezer. I have both, but I like the hand squeezer better, and use it much more often than the pneumatic. I haven't found anything the pneumatic can do that the hand can't do. My hand squeezer is the one from Avery.

I like the hand squeezer because it's lighter and easier to handle, easier to get straight, and faster to set up. If doing only a couple of rivets, or rivets of different sizes, it doesn't have to be adjusted perfectly, you can squeeze the proper amount by feel. Basically, it's a simple tool that does the job well.

Actually, I think the more important question ... rather than pneumatic vs hand ... is which yokes. The yokes are the key! The more yokes the more rivets you'll be able to squeeze instead of bang.

A sugestion I would make, is if you get a hand squeezer get one that uses the standard yokes ... the ones that can be used with the pneumatic squeezer. That gives you the most flexability if you end up getting both squeezers.

++LooseNut

[papakeith]

Alright, I've been chewing on the responses for a little bit now. I've come up with another angle.

Bearing in mind that the Bearhawk's control surfaces are fabric covered, I started thinking about how many rivets I'll really be able to squeeze as opposed to bucking, and if any number of the normally squeezed rivets couldn't be just as well bucked.

Which brought me to this thought: For all of my rib stiffener angles couldn't I simply buck them? I've got the compressor, I would need the rivet gun and the required sets to use it.

thoughts?

[LooseNut]

PK,

There's nothing wrong with bucking the rivets. There's more than one way to do most things. In building a metal airplane ya gotta learn all the riveting techniques. You'll quickly learn where you like to use each technique.

If this is your first riveting ... practice on some scraps first ... you'll get the hang of it in no time.

Something I slowly figured out when riveting small parts together ... make sure you clamp them up to some thing like your bench so they aren't moving around when you hit it with the gun, or lean on it with the squeezer.

Still, I think squeezing the rivets is easier. When I rivet, I usually follow this progression of choices:
1) Squeeze with hand or pneumatic squeezer
2) Back-rivet with rivet gun (bucking bar on manufactured head)
3) Rivet with rivet gun (rivet gun on manufactured head)

++LooseN