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Well, we just got back from Osh and saw lots of slick little goodies. What piece of hardware is hauting you that you really want to put in yer plane?

Its got to be the G900 for me.

-- John

I didn't get to see any of the goodies at OSH but... I'm really liking that Dynon FlightDEK 180. I think they are going to pack some great features into that unit in the coming months.

I really like the ACS3500 but it's getting kind of spendy. Dynon still seems to be more affordable for me.

Spike wrote:Well, we just got back from Osh and saw lots of slick little goodies. What piece of hardware is hauting you that you really want to put in yer plane?

Its got to be the G900 for me.

-- John

Going for the cheap one huh? A mere, what, $35K or so?

HA!! Try TWICE that amount!!! No kidding!!

I thought the G900 was the certified version and was like half the price of the G900X which is targeted toward the experimental market (ha, ha). I thought the G900 was in the 30's and the G900X was in the 60's?

What's up with that? Did anyone talk to Garmin and find out if that's the case? And why??

I called Garmin after getting a quote on the G900 RV-7 panel they had on disply of $89,000 to make sure they guy had it right. Yes that's Eighty Nine Thousand and no hundreds.

Chad's correct that the G900 alone in a box is $66,000 and then add your TruTrack, other accessories and you're gettin' up there.

That was one of the items I really wanted to see at OSH and I have to say I am VERY HAPPY with the price of the G900! The reason I'm so happy is I don't EVER have to worry about paying to put one in my plane! I can fall asleep with a smile on my face knowing I will never have one.

Done!

- Peter

I never said I would have one, only that it was haunting me. As for the particular on on display, the owner didn't pay that. The owner is an employee of Garmin, and when I asked him how well they took care of him, he just grinned.

Yeah, I talked to him at the BBQ on Wed PM, and he wasn't saying anything...Really nice guy though!

Garmin is on CRACK!

No way, no how... not gonna happen!

Experimental pilots are not gonna spend that kinda loot!

They will sell VERY FEW at that price tag!

They need to be COMPETITIVE in order to COMPETE!

That is not competitive. They are not competitors in my mind.

CJ

C'mon CJ, there are plenty of people out there with more money than sense. The Lancair and Epic LT guys (even some RV-10'ers) will eat this stuff up.

True... it is just WRONG!!!

CJ

captain_john wrote: Experimental pilots are not gonna spend that kinda loot!

You ever seen the price of a lancair kit? The amount of money that people put into the panels of some of the higher performance kit planes? One of the Velocities on display hat $80K in its panel. Sure they will spend it.

They will sell VERY FEW at that price tag!

Maybe, maybe not. What is 'very few'? Maybe their goal is to sell 20 per year. This particular product is being delivered to manufacturers for OEM installation by the pallet load. Any more they sell is probably gravy. They might not care if they only sell 'very few'.

They need to be COMPETITIVE in order to COMPETE!

Im not convinced that they aren't competative John. There are very few products out there that are as fully integrated and functionaly encompassing as this isthat also have the numbers flying and field support that the Garmin does. Are they priced a fair amount higher than some of the others? You bet, but that is not the only aspect of competition.

That is not competitive. They are not competitors in my mind.

Not to kick ya too hard John, but that just means that you might not be their target audience.

I agree that it has a very hefty price tag, which is probably the only reason that I wont have one. For us RV'ers that product would just about double our cost of building. Not so for some of the higher end aircraft. Would it be so "expensive" if it were to only add 50%? How about 25%? It really is in perspective.

Looking at the RV's though, as worst case, you can now get a 2 place airplane that cruises ~160kt, is potentially aerobatic, sips ~9GPH, and has the most advanced and integrated avionics suite available, for ~$150K. Compare that to anything else in the market place. The Diamonds, Extras, Liberty, etc, dont even come anywhere near that. If your building your plane for sport flying with a angle towards value, then the Garmin unit makes no sense.

If your building your plane for touring and going places, more my speed, then the Garmin unit is extremely attractive. Don't get me wrong, I do think that is a serious amount of dough, and I can't afford it, at least not until its price comes down, but I dont think that Garmin is totally off of their rocker.

- John

captain_john wrote:True... it is just WRONG!!!

CJ

It still is just wrong...

CJ

In two or three years there will be stuff on the market that does twice as much for MUCH less than half the price. I think this shows that Experimental aviation is driving the market. Even Garmin is starting to cater to us. I think once they recoup their development costs (which is what I think this is all about) they may lower the price on the experimental unit, or offer a single screen solution with all or more of the same functionality.

This is a great time to be building planes!

Oh, and I ain't buyin' one neither!

I think Garmin was worried about their G1000 customers getting cranked that the experimental guys could buy the same thing they bought for far less money so they just kept it where it was.

They're just chucking the G900 up against the wall to see if it sticks. They dont' care if they sell any.

Some marketing guru got paid a ton of money to think that one up. SHEESH!

- Peter

Sure it looks nice, but I'm not getting it either ... that price is just evil ... so I'm not getting it on principal!

Loose

It's worse than wrong, it's obscene. Once Toyota starts building airplanes, Van's and Cessna and Garmin will all be out of business. A glass panel ought to be about $3500. No typo, that's thirty five *hundred.* Transistors are cheaper than dirt.

Where's Henry Ford when you need him? His accountants told him they needed to raise the price of the cars to meet expenses. He fired the entire floor full of bean counters and lowered the price instead. He kept chipping away at the price until he had enough sales volume to make substantial profits.

Look how much car you can buy for forty thousand dollars and how little airplane you can buy for two hundred thousand dollars. Thirty thousand dollars for an engine invented in the 1930's? Rivet some tin around it and bolt on a couple of seats and about as many moving parts as a skateboard and then sell it for more money than I make in five years? Why do I feel like I'm living in a fairy tale named "The emperor's new clothes?"

Jeez, I must be in a bad mood today. Sorry.

That is no joke Pwich! We've always maintained around here the fact that glass paneled airplanes SHOULD be substantially cheaper than steam. Transistors, microprocessors, and chips ARE cheap! Makes no sense at all in my book. At least the mainstream experimental glass is more realistically priced, though still higher than they should be.

I'm stickin' with steam gauges, and no gyros.

Cheap to manufacture. But let me ask, how do you recover the millions of dollars spent on development? Especially when the production volume is extremely low?

Well, therein lies the problem of high dollar/low volume products. Can't make it cheaper 'cuz the volume ain't there, can't increase volume when it's priced so high... We all know this, and I'm not saying that they won't succeed. It's Garmin, they will. I just know it's stupid money for what it is.

I fly behind the 1000 all the time in the DA40. I would say that about 15% (not just for me, but whenever it is dispatched) of the time, it comes back with problems. Loose wires, bad transistor, knobs fall off, the screen won't brighten, the warning system is giving false warnings...It's neat, but there are still far to many problems with it. Those are all real problems we've had in six months of operating it. Then there's the airframe issues, but that's a Diamond thing...