Complete idiot

prestwich · Post by **prestwich** » Fri May 12, 2006 7:03 pm

OK, this is by far the stupidest thing that any RV builder has ever done.

I assembled the entire VS rear spar (-7) without dimpling it. Now the shop heads and hinge brackets are in the way of the dimpler. Before I make a bad situation worse, I'm open to suggestions...

TomNativeNewYorker · Post by **TomNativeNewYorker** » Fri May 12, 2006 7:12 pm

Remove rivets and if that doesnt give you the clearance, the bracket as well. Only 4-6 rivets to remove, a lot quicker than thinking of ways to avoid drilling out rivets.

prestwich · Post by **prestwich** » Fri May 12, 2006 8:07 pm

Well, it's worse than that. The whole doubler is in the way, and it's attached with 74 rivets. I thought about making a female dimpler die with a smaller OD, but there isn't even enough clearance for the yoke.

captain_john · Post by **captain_john** » Fri May 12, 2006 8:43 pm

One of 3 things can be done.

1) Remove all 74 rivets dimple and reassemble.

2) Grind the female dimple set and the yoke to allow the appropriate clearance.

3) Buy new parts.

Me? I would drill the 74 rivets out and have a look at it. Odds are, if done correctly you will be able to dimple and reassemble it with no problemmo.

Nuttin' to it but ta do it!

CJ

Lorin Dueck · Post by **Lorin Dueck** » Fri May 12, 2006 10:56 pm

Prestwich -
I feel your pain!!

Have you thought about modifying a couple of "blind rivet" dimple dies??
Lorin D
9A Wings
(N194LD reserved)

4kilo · Post by **4kilo** » Fri May 12, 2006 11:39 pm

Prestwich,

Three things occur to me:

1. Don't do anything until you have talked to Van's. Work on something else 'til then.

2. My response to this would probably be to machine countersink the spar. You would want to clamp and drill a disposable doubler to the back of the spar to hold the countersink pilot steady. Again, just my advice, talk to Van's first.

3. Definitely not the stupidest thing ever done by a builder. A few months ago I drilled into the middle finger of my left hand. Very painful, but a lesson learned, right? Before the first wound had even healed, I drilled another hole; not only in the same finger, nearly the same place, but entirely through the finger and out the middle of the finger nail. The wonderful feeling of the second time made the first seem nearly pleasant.

Pat

JohnR · Post by **JohnR** » Sat May 13, 2006 12:06 am

4kilo, I feel your pain, really I do!

jim_geo · Post by **jim_geo** » Sat May 13, 2006 1:16 am

Machine counter sink would by my guess also. I'm in the "do something else for awhile" camp and call Vans on Monday or better Tuesday, I've heard Monday is a way busy day for them. Perhaps you could modify a close quarter dimpler.

aparchment · Post by **aparchment** » Sat May 13, 2006 9:07 am

Hi Prestwich:

I just checked for you, and the Avery vice grip close quarter dimpling tool will fit that space even with the doubler installed. It should do a reasonable job on that thickness of aluminum. Besides, it will come in handy on your rudder and elevators.

Antony

cjensen · Post by **cjensen** » Sat May 13, 2006 10:33 am

pwich,

Here's my solution to a similar problem:

I did that with a cheap hand squeezer yoke, and female die. It's still very usable.

On CSing the VS skin...I'd check on that. Can't remember how thick it is, but it might be right there on the edge...

Oh, and the only thing stupid at this point, would be for you to look at this, and quit. Not a big deal, find the fix, and move on! There have DEFINITELY been bigger mistakes than this, and those airplanes are flying!

prestwich · Post by **prestwich** » Sat May 13, 2006 11:17 am

Thanks to all for your suggestions and encouragement. I'm not ready to throw in the towel yet, but this sure adds a little volume to the voice of the QB angel.

Antony, are you saying that the shoulder of the die on the vise grip unit is short enough to actually slip between the doubler and the flange of the spar? So only about 0.100" long? And the vise grip jaw clears everything, too? That sounds like a great solution!

captain_john · Post by **captain_john** » Sat May 13, 2006 11:53 am

P-wich, he is. AND it is a wonderful tool to boot!

That is definately yor best "out" of this one!!!

Good one Antony!

CJ

jim_geo · Post by **jim_geo** » Sat May 13, 2006 2:04 pm

but this sure adds a little volume to the voice of the QB angel.

You would've still had to cross this bridge. Beside that this is a type of mistake I'll bet you never make again.

aparchment · Post by **aparchment** » Sat May 13, 2006 2:24 pm

Prestwich:

I will post a pic for you this evening.

Antony

4kilo · Post by **4kilo** » Sat May 13, 2006 6:54 pm

cjensen wrote: On CSing the VS skin...I'd check on that. Can't remember how thick it is, but it might be right there on the edge...

Chad, I don't think anyone suggested countersinking the skin.

Pat

prestwich · Post by **prestwich** » Sat May 13, 2006 9:08 pm

I'm going to order the vise grip dimplers, because I'm sure they'll come in handy later as mentioned.

As far as not making the same "type" of mistake again, that's probably true (unless you count drilling holes in your finger as a "mistake" rather than an "accident.") The trouble is, judging by my ability to make new types of mistakes, I don't think I'll run out of them anytime soon.

Chad and CJ, I like the idea of grinding off one side of a die and yoke, but I don't have any inexpensive ones that I would consider sacrificial. But, in the interest of expediting the project, rather than waiting for the vise grip dimplers, I made some custom offset dimple dies. The shank is centered, but the forming features are set right on the edge. They actually work great!

I just wonder who's hijacked my brain when stuff like this happens. It's totally incomprehensible to me.

Lorin Dueck · Post by **Lorin Dueck** » Sat May 13, 2006 10:10 pm

P-wich
Sweet solution!!!
Let us know how it works out & best o' luck!!
Lorin D

bmurrish · Post by **bmurrish** » Sat May 13, 2006 10:44 pm

wow, don't let that sucker get out of alignment

aparchment · Post by **aparchment** » Sat May 13, 2006 11:37 pm

Prestwich:

Nice solution. How on earth did you manage to pull something like that together so quickly? Do you have a lathe?

Here is the pic I promised.

Antony

cjensen · Post by **cjensen** » Sat May 13, 2006 11:42 pm

4kilo wrote:
cjensen wrote: On CSing the VS skin...I'd check on that. Can't remember how thick it is, but it might be right there on the edge...
Chad, I don't think anyone suggested countersinking the skin.

Pat

Misread your original post on CSing the spar Pat...oops, my bad.

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